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Some Background Notes -- My Background With Ormus and Ormus-like

ver. 1.0.20

last revision date: 12/31/2023

Some Background

As you may already know if you are familiar with my work, I am a degreed scientist with a graduate degree in the health-related sciences and additional graduate-level work in clinical psychology and acupuncture; if you wish to see a more extensive biography or take a look at the fields in which I perform scientific R&D and consulting, please see my main website at where a more detailed biography is available. Among my other interests in the sciences, I have for many years worked as a researcher with devices which have employed magnetic, electric or electromagnetic fields to modify the properties of water and other liquids. I have also experimented for years with devices which exposed water and other liquids (and foods as well) not to the more conventional types of fields listed above, but rather to any of several types of "subtle energy" fields produced by various types of beneficial microbes, gemstones, rock, minerals and trace elements, with some particular emphasis upon the use of certain ores containing high levels of rare earth elements and transition elements (as well as ormus forms of elements) for such treatments. 

As I have related elsewhere on the web, I have worked with ormus-type forms of elements and ormus-like effects for years, since at least the early 1980s, although descriptive terms such as "ormus" or "ormes" did not emerge until somewhat later.  However, my background in ormus research is very atypical, and very different from that of most researchers in the field. While most researchers in the ormus world have focused almost exclusively upon means of isolating or refining ormus using inorganic chemistry (including heating and distillation), I have, since the late 1980s or perhaps earlier, always been strongly guided by inner guidance from Holy Spirit and my angels to entirely ignore the methods of ormus isolation or production which have involved inorganic chemistry (i.e., methods employing fire, distillation, acid/base reactions, strong oxidizers, etc.), and instead, my research has always been focused on ormus or ormus-like effects derived or produced from what I tend to call "non-traditional" phenomena or technologies. And, rather than repeat myself extensively here, if you wish a detailed biography of various ormus-related fields in which I have worked over the years, I encourage you to take a look on the main page of this website at the bulleted list of "non-traditional" ormus and ormus-like technologies listed there. I have also reproduced an abbreviated list below, as follows:

  • ormus found naturally-occurring in plant and animal foods

  • ormus produced and/or isolated by activities of beneficial microbes, particularly PNSB and Syntropic antioxidative microbial (SAM) Type 4 consortia

  • ormus produced by exposure of water and other liquids to various types of subtle energy field effects. It is in this realm that my interest in the use of ormus-like forms of elements as nutritional supplements and my interest in devices which treat water via passive exposure to various electric, magnetic, electromagnetic or subtle-energy (aka "no-classical" or "non-Hertzian") fields have intersected. This latter realm is one which is largely the focus of this ormuswater website.

  • the ormus-like subtle energy effects of some forms and geometries of magnetic fields upon water.

  • the ormus-like effects of some pyramids, cones, and flat or conical spirals of wire/metallic tubing on people and water.

  • ormus like subtle energy effects produced by exposing water or other liquids to certain types of gemstones, rock, minerals and trace elements.

  • the ormus-like subtle energy effects exhibited by some technologies, many of them high-voltage technologies, which direct a spark, corona or plasma discharge through water or people, or which expose the liquids or people to be treated to a plasma discharge.

  • the ormus-like subtle energy effects of various 10th+ generation cold fusion electrochemical cells, particularly those employing tungsten/titanium electrodes and KCL and lithium salts in the electrolyte; these devices have been widely cited as emitting all sorts of subtle-energy effects and some versions are known to emit small ball-lightning discharges which leave the glass beaker and move about the room.

  • the ormus-like subtle energy effects of various inter-related technologies which have often, since the late 1930s, been called "orgone" devices (i.e., the "orgone box" and the "cloudbuster".)

  • the ormus-like subtle energy effects of some trace elements and nutrients (such as certain forms of vitamin B12) when treated with primitive primeval atomic hydrogen antioxidants such as those found in so-called alkaline ionized water (really better referenced as electrolyzed reduced water, or ERW) and the silica hydride products developed by Dr. Patrick Flanagan, such as MegaH.

  • the powerful subtle energy properties of powerful liquid nutritional products developed by Dr. George Merkl known variously across the years under various names, including Chondriana, Life Crystals, Sumerian Elixir, Vida Source and others; these products were produced by microbial fermentation in a glass container exposed to direct sunlight called a Solar Reactor.

And, for a Much Lighter View..

My Vinny Pinto Public Page at Facebook (aka Facebook "fan page"):

Threads social media page: @vinny.pinto.1   

Bluesky Social page:

and Blog page:

Some further notes about ormus and ormus-related terminology appear in sections below ...

A Short Glossary
Please bear in mind as you peruse the pages of this website the meanings of the following terms:

MEOW -- magnetite effect ormus water

MEOW device -- a device employing a mass of magnetite black sand which is used for MEOW transformation of water or other aqueous liquids. A MEOW device usually consists of a container holding a shell of magnetite with a hollow within into which a bottle of water may be inserted for treatment.

MEOW kettle -- an alternate term for a MEOW device; term is used interchangeably with the terms MEOW device or MEOW alembic.

MEOW alembic -- an alternate term for a MEOW device; term is used interchangeably with the terms MEOW kettle or MEOW device.

If you wish to read more about these terms and how they came into use, please see the section entitled A Note on Boring Terms and Not-So-Boring Terms and a Short Glossary, on the main page of the OrmusWater/MEOW directory of this website.

First, Some Notes About So-Called "Ormus" Elements

First, a big sigh.... I believe that there is a tremendous amount of myth and folklore and outright hype in the ormus world, and I would prefer not to even delve into that realm in much depth! Much as I have written in the past, much of what a number of the early popularizers of "ormus" elements have ever written have simply given me a headache or made me go cross-eyed, and I learned quickly to ignore most of the words and claims of many of the promoters in this field. (By the way, if you wish to read some pretty reasonable and sane reports on ormus and ormus-like effects, I can recommend the websites of Barry Carter; his work seems to me to be much more grounded and clear and sane that the reports of some of the earlier popularizers in this field; one of his primary ormus sites may be found at

Ormus Water and Magnetic Treatment Devices for Water

Aside from the ever-present and massive levels of hype and malarkey, one of the main challenges of the ormus world, and a primary reason why it "can't get no respect" from most mainstream scientists and healthcare professionals, is that no one in the ormus world can agree on what tests really do detect so-called "ormus" materials. Worse, for the few who do agree on a particular test, their hypotheses, theories and models are often quite contradictory (and often self-contradictory as well) and  often make no sense to most observers. A second problem, and one related to the issue of hype and malarkey mentioned earlier, is the truly bizarre and misleading frivolous (and often self-contradictory) "expert" statements made on many of the larger ormus vendor websites, such as:
"...our favorite expert says (but we forget the exact reference / citation...) that low pH will deactivate ormus...". sigh!

A third phenomenon which helps to create a massive credibility problem for the ormus field is that of vendors who publish fraudulent test results (i.e., claiming that their fictitious results for ormus percentage in their product were the result of testing with a non-existent four million dollar high-tech testing machine); I have related elsewhere on the web a tale of such a claim which I debunked in the late 1990s.

Much the same observation that I shared above about the lack of respect for ormus materials and properties in the mainstream scientific and healthcare worlds is also true of most devices which claim to employ magnetic fields to treat water (for any of a variety of intended effects, most of which are not related to induction of ormus-like properties), and for much the same reasons.

Ormus Water and Vortex-type Water Treatment Devices

I have noticed over the past few years that several vendors are now offering "ormus water" devices which use high-speed blenders as "vortex generators" and fixed magnets with alternating poles taped or glued around the perimeter of the blender body; these devices are claimed to produce "magnetic ormus water" offering great benefit to humans. However, while it is my impression (verified by some of my work in the lab) that many of these devices do indeed impart certain changes to the physical properties of water, if only short-term, due to the effect of moving the water through a magnetic field, my intuitive sense has always told me to totally avoid such gizmos, advising me that the water produced by such devices is not particularly useful or beneficial for me nor for most people whom I know (i.e., my friends, colleagues and consulting clients, etc.). In fact, various vendors of such devices have, over the years, offered to send me free samples of such devices for my use in testing, likely hoping to gain an endorsement from me for their products. In each case, these motorized magnetic vortex devices and similar treatment devices have left me cold, meaning that in each case, my intuition (some call it gut sense) told me that the technology was producing little or no beneficial effect in the water or juice (at least for me) which was treated. Thus, I have had little or no interest in these devices.

However, the only "magnetic ormus water" technology which I have ever encountered where my intuition immediately kicked in and told me that the resultant water produced by the device would have powerful and beneficial effects for me (and for many folks with whom I work on a consulting basis) was the "magnetic water" technology using magnetite sand developed by Dr. John V. Milewski. The device to which I am referring is a design for a static (i.e. the water is sitting still, not moving, and the device employs no moving magnets nor any other moving parts nor fields) magnetic-type water treatment device using magnetite sand, where a bottle of water is immersed in a cylinder submerged inside a mass of magnetite sand for several days at a time before being drunk as a nutritional supplement. One of several websites featuring John's research work with these devices may be found at

An Email List Group of Interest

The Forbidden Science (VP) group hosted at encompasses and subsumes topics covered by each of the several relevant legacy list groups that I had operated at private Yahoo Groups, including Exotic Energies, Ormus-like, Ormus PWT, Time-Space Doorways, Elixir Vitae, Jenny Cell, Radiation Hormesis/Radiation Nutrition, and Quantum Quiet (space effect devices) legacy list groups.

Forbidden Science (VP)
The term "forbidden science" was first coined in the 1980s by Dr. Jaques Vallee, a PhD computer scientist and strange/fringe science researcher, to describe those fields of scientific investigation that the current scientific "establishment" tends to view as quack science, or as fringe science, and as undesirable topics for "serious" scientists to research; those fields include the topic of UFOs and "space aliens", alchemy, ormus nutritionals, the paranormal, overunity devices, exotic energies (aka prana or chi) beyond the pale of conventional electromagnetics, and numerous other "fringe science" and "strange science" realms.

This list group serves as a continuation of the various legacy forbidden science list groups, listed above, that were operated by Vinny Pinto for 15+ years until the October 2019 downscaling of Yahoo Groups. Vinny is a mystic, spiritual teacher/guide, spiritual healer, and a multi-disciplinary consulting and R&D scientist/engineer.

The primary focus of this list group is to discuss topics in the realms of forbidden science, aka strange science, aka fringe science, including UFOs and "space aliens", alchemy, ormus nutritionals, the paranormal, overunity devices, exotic energies (aka prana or chi) beyond the pale of conventional electromagnetics, and numerous other "fringe science" and "strange science" realms.

While the name and description of this list group are publicly listed at and on search engines, all posts sent to the list group are private and are viewable by list group members only. This is a moderated list group. Further, all applicants wishing to join the list group must state their reasons for wishing to join along with their name and general location, and all posts sent to the list group must be signed with the poster's first and last name in order to be published. We do not tolerate hate posts, and we do not tolerate trolls, nor troll posts.

How to Join
If you are interested in joining this list group, you may do so by visiting the list group home page and clicking "Join" at:

Or you may send an email to:

Please note that the list group, as is true of all of my email list groups, are restricted-membership list groups, and thus, once you have applied to join, you will then shortly receive an email from the mailserver, entitled something along the lines of "Your Pending Membership in….", which will ask you for certain information; you will need to send the requested information (including your first and last name) back to the list group moderators by replying to the message if you wish your application for membership to be approved.


This material is offered solely for educational and informational purposes. Any products and/or information presented are not intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease. These statements have not been evaluated by the FDA (in USA.)

Any products, technologies or devices mentioned on this page are experimental prototypes only, produced for the sole purposes of research and Proof of Principle (PoP) evaluation by professional or individual researchers or experimenters. The reader understands that the author is not engaged in rendering health or medical advice or services. The site owner and authors provide this information, and the reader accepts it, with the understanding that people act on it at their own risk and with full knowledge that they should consult with licensed primary care medical professionals for any medical assistance they may need.  The author(s) of the material presented on this site are neither medical nor nutritional professionals. 

If you wish to learn more about my work and/or about my consulting services, please feel free to visit my main website at

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